How do brands win during the Super Bowl?

Nataly Kelly [00:00:00]: Welcome to Inside Insight, where marketing strategy meets consumer truth with your host, Nataly Kelly. The Super Bowl isn't just big, it's the biggest stage in advertising. Last year, Super Bowl LIX averaged a new record, 127.7 million viewers. That kind of attention is rare, fleeting, and expensive. But winning here isn't about just one ad, one viral moment, or one night of buzz. The brands that succeed plan long before kickoff, using consumer insights to guide bold, brave, creative, and connected campaigns that stretch across pregame, in-game, and postgame moments.

Nataly Kelly [00:00:41]: I'm Nataly Kelly and today on Inside Insights, I'm joined by two absolute marketing legends who know what it takes to win on the biggest advertising stage: Mark Kirkham, CMO of PepsiCo Beverages, US, and Greg Guidotti, CMO of the Ferrara Candy Company. We'll dive into what it actually means to win with consumers during the Super Bowl, how insights give teams the confidence to be bold, and why the best Super Bowl advertising is built not as a single spot, but as a system. Mark and Greg, welcome to the show.

Mark Kirkham [00:01:12]: Hey, thanks Nat.

Greg Guidotti [00:01:13]: Thank you very much.

Mark Kirkham [00:01:14]: Yeah, thanks. I appreciate, I appreciate the intro. It has to be corrected.

Greg Guidotti [00:01:19]: We have one legend, which is Kirkham, and then his friend Greg Guidotti, that's the CMO of the Ferrara Candy Company. So he used to be my boss. So I think I'll take that as much love.

Nataly Kelly [00:01:28]: Well, that actually brings me to my very first question because I was going to ask both of you for a quick intro and then I'd love to find out how you actually got to know each other.

Mark Kirkham [00:01:36]: Yeah, sure. So, Mark Kirkham, I'm the CMO of PepsiCo Beverages in the U.S. I've been with the company 15 years. Used to be the CMO of our international business, only in beverages. So I spent my whole career in beverages. And before I came to PepsiCo 15 years ago, I worked at kind of Gillette, P&G. Kind of came out of the Gillette side with this guy, with Greg Guidotti, and we worked on the battery category, exciting and powerful brands like Duracell and learned a lot about brand building and spent a lot of time internationally, both personally and on different businesses throughout the last 25 years. So excited to be here and excited to spend time with my good friend and partner over, over the other side.

Greg Guidotti [00:02:18]: Yeah, and my story is, I actually started, you know, right out of undergrad. I was in advertising for a bit and then, and then moved over to the client, which was starting at Kraft. Kraft was on the east coast and then I decided to leave Kraft and, and join Gillette. And that's when Kirkham and I got to work together. And, and honestly we talked to, we've talked a bit, but there's that element of like every brand you touch is something that you hold in your heart.

Greg Guidotti [00:02:40]: And you know, we talk about bleeding copper and black. I refer to Mark Kirkham as one of my bfams. Like, we have a whole group of our Duracell crew that are brothers from another mother. It's very funny.

Greg Guidotti [00:02:52]: So you have that history. We have that history together from, from. And again, we were both working in global roles and then, you know, Mark went to Pepsi to do stuff internationally and now, now here I went from a global role to an international role for Duracell batteries. And then I actually returned to Kraft and I was at Kraft, then became Kraft Heinz. And then I've been here at Ferrara as the CMO for about, about seven years.

Greg Guidotti [00:03:17]: And it's like, it really is. I've been looking forward to this discussion. Kirkham is, has been an incredible colleague and a great friend through those years. And it's amazing when, you know, you just pick up. We, we, we, you know, with, with Pepsi actually having an office here in the old post office.

Greg Guidotti [00:03:33]: We get to see each other every once in a while and it's just an honor and because the guy has, the guy has been on a rocket ship with incredible talent and it's, you know, great to have a conversation here and talking about Super Bowl.

Nataly Kelly [00:03:44]: That's awesome. I do have to ask a follow up question there. So you guys both were in global roles. Where were you in the world?

Mark Kirkham [00:03:52]: We were, yeah. Bethel, Connecticut. Where, if you're in a global role, where else would you be but Bethel, Connecticut? No, we, I, I joined right at the time of the Gillette P&G acquisition and moved down to Connecticut from Boston. And yeah, so we worked on batteries for my five years in, in Internet Global and then last year in the US before jumping ship to come over here.

Greg Guidotti [00:04:16]: So yeah, we had a great time.

Mark Kirkham [00:04:17]: Yeah, it was a great, it was a great time. And I think we won't spend too much time on this, but I think, I mean, you know, marketing batteries is one of the hardest jobs you can ever have. And we, we talked about it because like, it's not a thing when you have other things when you, when you work in food or something like that, you could expand consumption with batteries. You can't.

Greg Guidotti [00:04:34]: You just will load the pantry because it's only predicated on the devices that you have so it makes you more talented. And I think we had and we leveraged, you know, distinctive assets that you would never, you know, you would never realize. But you feel, I mean, there is the, there's the, you know, 1/3 copper, 2/3 black in terms of a battery. There's the, the sound, like the slam and sound on that front. So, you know, in the.

Mark Kirkham [00:04:54]: And the tone, like, ding, ding, ding, like those kind of things. And it had. There's a history and a story to each one of those. Those elements. So I feel like, you know, I grew exponentially as a marketer, you know, in the global work that we did.

Greg Guidotti [00:05:07]: And, and then, you know, spending, spending almost three years in Singapore across Asia was great. Just made me a better marketer as I came back to Kraft and now Ferrara.

Nataly Kelly [00:05:17]: Wow, that's so interesting. I love the history and hearing you guys talk about the brand and, and where you overlap, that's really a great background. So I have a question for you, Mark.

Nataly Kelly [00:05:25]: The industry treats the Super Bowl like a single play. I heard you talk about this last year on the ground on a panel that you were on in New Orleans. And a lot of folks talk afterward about which ad was the winner, which brand stole the spotlight, which spot topped all these various rankings. But you guys are managing campaigns that start months before kickoff, sometimes years. So how do you think about success differently than the scoreboard the industry uses? And what does winning actually mean from your perspective when it comes to the work you do in Super Bowl advertising?

Mark Kirkham [00:05:56]: Well, I think winning very clearly is growing the business and growing the brand. You know, Super Bowl is one moment in time. It's an important. It's a special moment.

Mark Kirkham [00:06:05]: But you can't get distracted on what the ultimate goal is. You know, whether it's educating consumer about your product, whether it's building an equity, whether it's launching something. And so I think that's, you know, one of the biggest watch outs. You know, winning at Super Bowl ultimately is growing your business, growing your brand. And there are many examples where winning was just an ad meter or just a social engagement or this or that.

Mark Kirkham [00:06:24]: And, and again, depending on the objectives of a brand, that might be an objective. I'm not saying we all aren't trying to make an impact at Super Bowl, but ultimately, if we're not moving the business forward, then the time, money, and investment actually don't actually help really drive the overall equity and the metrics of the brand. And if I use last year as an example with, with Mountain Dew, you know, our ultimate goal was to kind of maintain the momentum of Mountain Dew, Baja Blast. I can tell you that at the end of the year we were still growing share. I can tell you at the end of the year we're still growing volume.

Mark Kirkham [00:06:55]: I can tell you that our integrated programming around Super Bowl drove significant multi channel and DoorDash, et cetera. Programming that allowed us to grow the business and drive trial and penetration. And that's the ultimate objective. Was it a great ad? Of course it was.

Mark Kirkham [00:07:09]: It was a fun ad. We made Seal a seal and it was top 25 in both Adweek and Ad Age. So that's great. But if I got all that and I wasn't moving the needle in the business, then it wouldn't have been successful. Successful.

Greg Guidotti [00:07:22]: It's really, it's really well said because I think it's, it's absolutely right and I think we never have. The Super Bowl is a platform. It's a, it's a place where, you know, where you guarantee eyes and, and with the world being so fragmented, it's the only place where you have that opportunity. So our only parameters are like, like, you know, Kirkham said, like we want to grow household penetration. That is the whole reason why we got into the Super.

Greg Guidotti [00:07:48]: We want to grow share. We want to build displays in advance of this, in this element. So Those are our KPIs in terms of our going in or getting there. And I think it's a really, really interesting, it's a really interesting element because different businesses have different objectives. But everybody knows that this is one of the last platforms where you could almost guarantee an audience.

Greg Guidotti [00:08:10]: So what you do with that audience is predicated on what you want to do as a business and a brand. And for Nerds, it has been about accelerating our household penetration year on year, growing share and growing the business. And you know, this is a business that was almost seven years ago a very nominal business. And now, you know, we're on the cusp of being over a billion dollar brand at retail. That's incredible.

Nataly Kelly [00:08:35]: That's incredible impact in such a short time. And that reminds me, Greg, I wanted to ask you about this topic. So Ferrara has some of the most beloved candy brands in the country, like Nerds and Sweet Tarts. When you're building for the Super Bowl, what are the consumer insights that actually move the needle for you? I know you talked about other metrics, but what are you looking to understand about your audience that gives you the confidence that the creative that you're investing in will actually land?

Greg Guidotti [00:08:57]: Well, it's interesting because this element of as an emotional category, like candy is an emotional category. It's a treat. There's no sustenance associated with this product. If I'm hungry, it's like, boy, I wish I had some Trolli. It's not like that.

Greg Guidotti [00:09:11]: It's very much a treat, it's very much a reward. And so that plays in nostalgia. So what we've tried to do with our portfolio is drive relevance to our brands and I think bringing new relevance to our brand. So as we think about what we do as we approach the Super Bowl, we spend a lot of time on social media organically with brand lovers because they are organically there. Just connecting with them and really just connecting at the speed of culture, that kind of stuff.

Greg Guidotti [00:09:34]: So you will see Lil Wayne loves Nerds Gummy Clusters. We send him a case of Nerds Gummy Clusters. He's posting from the studio with Nicki Minaj. They were having a fun time in the studio and he wrote a song and Nerds is in that song. Now that song might not be playable for all families, but it's a great sign, talks about that brand love.

Greg Guidotti [00:09:55]: So I'm rambling a little bit, but this element of like, we spend a lot of time connecting with culture and then when it comes to our spot, we're making sure that we're again, we've got clear parameters. If our objective is to grow household penetration, we want to make sure that we have breakthrough and attributes. So it, you know, attributes to our brand and they recognize that this is this. It broke through. I saw it.

Greg Guidotti [00:10:13]: I recognize that it's Nerds. I recognize that it's Nerds Gummy Clusters, these elements. And then as you go to, you know, as we start working, you know, you get into the season, we're making sure that we're placing displays and having display fixtures in every, in every channel, at every pillar. So whether it be convenience stores or mass merchants or club or even e-commerce, making sure we've got a presence. So our success there is like, I mean the Super Bowl is, you know, won before the ad ever is run when it comes to that kind of like the in-store.

Greg Guidotti [00:10:43]: And I think, you know, you just look at Kirkham and what Pepsi, what Pepsi does is better than anybody else in the world. And so we aspire to like that kind, to be that good. But the fact is, year on year, we've increased our amounts of our display. Not only quantity but, but quality of placement. And then after it is just tracking the KPIs of household penetration, sales, share.

Nataly Kelly [00:11:07]: Wow. I mean, I remember last year landing in the. In the airport in New Orleans and seeing both of your brands with pretty amazing activations at the airport. And, you know, the Mountain Dew. I think I even sent you a picture, Mark, of the signage.

Mark Kirkham [00:11:21]: Yeah. Because it was right after I landed from Boston, right outside my gate. I was like, well, there, there's Seal, and all of this is right there in front of me.

Nataly Kelly [00:11:30]: And then I also took a bunch of pictures with your activation, Greg, because there was a giant Nerds Gummy Cluster in the airport on my way to baggage. So it's really impressive to see how you guys manage all of that from social online to offline, to really connect that advertising and the whole campaign all through all those different touch points.

Nataly Kelly [00:11:48]: So, really excited to see what you have in store this year. So I have a question for you both next. So with the stakes being this high and millions of dollars on the line for the ad spots on the night, I'd love if you could talk to me a little bit about the creative process. So where does consumer evidence come in? And where do you rely on instinct and creative bravery and kind of say, you know what? We're not going to listen to what the consumers are saying on this one. We believe really confidently in our ideas here. How do you balance those two things when you're making the final creator decisions? And. And also, how would you describe the pressure of doing that as you go into the Super Bowl?

Mark Kirkham [00:12:21]: I think the first thing is the pressure is what you make of it. You know, ultimately, yes, it's a big media buy, but it's an opportunity. I actually think it's more the excitement than it is the pressure. It's an opportunity to reinforce or amplify or introduce something to one of the largest audience at a single given point in time. And as you also pointed out earlier, it's not just about those 30 seconds.

Mark Kirkham [00:12:42]: It's about everything you surround it with. You know, the process. To me, I think where this gets back to your original question. I think brands sometimes forget why they're doing it. Yeah.

Mark Kirkham [00:12:52]: And what is the ultimate goal? And therefore, that affects the process. I will tell you, for every one of our Super Bowl ads, there is always a clear business objective and brand objective at the beginning. So if you go back Baja Blast, we had a growing business. We wanted to maintain the momentum after year one launch, which we also launched at the Super Bowl.

Mark Kirkham [00:13:12]: We had an awareness challenge, and we had a what flavor is it challenge. That's why it was called Kiss from a Lime. We wanted people to know that Baja Blast is lime flavored. So we had to build from that premise. Now, that didn't automatically get us to Seal as a seal.

Mark Kirkham [00:13:28]: That was a creative articulation. But. But I think you need to start with that and you need to decomp. And for us, typically it starts sometime, call it August, September of a given year.

Mark Kirkham [00:13:39]: Hey, are we going to do Super Bowl? And by the way, the answer isn't always yes. The answer is, well, show me why we should. And I can tell you, the last two years, sitting in front of my CEO and presenting an idea, if I wasn't confident and in both cases laughing my butt off, I would not have gotten the green light to spend the money and do that. And I think that's important because it is a business decision.

Mark Kirkham [00:14:01]: It's a pretty significant one time investment at a point in time. Now for us too. It also is part of our overall strategy with the NFL. You know, we've been a longtime partner. There's a lot more that we are able to do because of our partnership. But ultimately it has to start with clear business strategy, clear creative idea, and plans to amplify that beyond just the 32nd spot.

Mark Kirkham [00:14:26]: And I think we've done a really good job this year as we go into it. I think in past years we've learned a lot, you know, and I think sometimes that is, hey, do you use talent? Do you not? Because then you extend rights and there's other complexities. But you need to give yourself time.

Mark Kirkham [00:14:38]: I can tell you, too many brands rush this process and the outputs aren't as great. Maybe they get lucky, but most don't. So I think giving yourself, you know, four to six months to really think it through, anchor in a business decision and make sure you truly believe in it. If everyone on the team is not truly, truly in love with the idea, then I don't think you're going to be as successful as you'd like.

Greg Guidotti [00:14:59]: Yeah, I think, I mean, Crazy. Kirkham is spot on. I mean, the fact is it starts with that business objective and brand objective. Can the Super Bowl help with that? I think the stakes are what you make them. And I think we try to, we try to, you know, temper the stress because now this is our third year, I would say our first year, there was a, there was a high level because it was something that Ferrara had never done. Nothing, not something that none of our brands had ever done.

Greg Guidotti [00:15:27]: So like the, the parameters of that were, were, were very high. But we said, but we were very, you know, we took the emotion out. What'd we learn? What are we going to do better? And I feel like our second iteration, you know, with Shabuzi was a, was a better articulation of Flash Dance in year one.

Greg Guidotti [00:15:44]: And then as we come to this third year, I know from a, you know, quantitative, from a qualitative perspective that we've got a better communication. But importantly, it delivers on our business objective. It delivers on our objectives of driving household penetration on this front. It's compelling to the consumer. It has recognition of the brand, it has recognition of the, the variant of that brand.

Greg Guidotti [00:16:08]: So it, so it delivers on all that front and then it's like, okay, how do we make it bigger around that spot on all that front? And again, you know, I never worry about am I going to be the top 10 or the top 50 or the worst. I know we're not going to be the worst, but I know it's going to win for the business. And that's the only thing that's on anybody's mind here.

Nataly Kelly [00:16:26]: That's so interesting. I mean, both of you being veteran Super Bowl advertisers now, having been involved in this multiple years in a row, you know, I, it's curious, I'm curious what your thoughts are on some of these brands that like do a one and done and they don't come back and apply those learnings the next year because there are some that show up and then that you don't see them again and then some show up only for the Super Bowl. It seems you don't see them elsewhere.

Mark Kirkham [00:16:51]: Yeah, I think it goes back to what is your business objective. One of the things I always struggle with is, and we've done it, is, you know, using the Super Bowl as a launch platform. Now again, back to the earlier point, you need to make sure you have the in-store support or the channel support, regardless of your business.

Mark Kirkham [00:17:08]: And so as a launch platform, that's a lot riskier. Right? So you gotta make sure that if someone learns about your brand, they can pick up the phone, they can go to a store, they can go online, whatever. I actually think it's better as a kind of reframe or amplification or kind of richer embedded storytelling than launch because of the fact that, you know, you start with a different base, you're starting with a base and maybe a smaller base than some big brands. But that's the reason why, you know, Budweiser's been doing the Clydesdales forever.

Mark Kirkham [00:17:34]: That's why you've seen some consistency. But the freshness still can come through. So you, you may be telling a story that might be similar to a story of the past, but how is it new? How is it different? And then I think the other thing is how do you leverage beyond just that 30 second to really tell the story?

Mark Kirkham [00:17:49]: When we grew up, you waited till that moment to see the Super Bowl ad. Now we're all going to tease, we're all going to drop, we're going to amplify and we're going to extend beyond. But that moment is still precious. And so what you do in that moment is still very important. So I think this, this idea of like how you think about the role of Super Bowl in your communication strategy is just as portion important as the creative itself.

Greg Guidotti [00:18:12]: Correct? Yeah, I think it's again it is this, it is this element. Like yeah, years and years ago you'd drop a spot in the Super Bowl and that was it. So much is done before, so much is done around and this becomes. But it all needs to build and amplify to that level of crescendo.

Greg Guidotti [00:18:27]: So you're prepared during, post at elements. But there's so many more opportunities and again based on your business objective, based on you, what you want to do, you might choose not to tease, you might choose not to release. Like we're going to like we're talking about stuff and so we're like it, it's become a lot more dynamic and a lot more interesting in, in that, that, that whole platform because there's so many things that you want to make sure work and particularly for businesses like ours in terms of the, you know, consumer packaged goods, you want to make sure you've got full distribution across all your channels. Before you talk about anything that might not be the case for financial services or something. You don't know, it really does depend but I think it's, it's quite, it is almost.

Greg Guidotti [00:19:05]: It's most dynamic for, for I feel and again a total bias with consumer packaged goods. Cause you have customer partners, you got distributors, you have all these partners that you want to make sure at all they're all working on that front. So when the consumer starts seeing it, they're seeing it everywhere.

Nataly Kelly [00:19:21]: Yeah, yeah. It's really interesting to think about the pre released ads now because only a fraction of consumers will see that compared to on the night. But I love that idea of building the crescendo and using this as a moment to amplify in many cases because if you don't have that base of awareness, it could be wasteful to, you know.

Mark Kirkham [00:19:39]: Yeah, that makes total sense.

Nataly Kelly [00:19:41]: So, Mark, I had a question for you. You know, you talked about the Mountain Dew ad from last year, but in general, when brands like Pepsi, Poppy, or Mountain Dew show up at the Super Bowl, you're not just creating a single ad for a massive moment of brand visibility. As we talked about, you're connecting it to that broader brand story that runs throughout the year. So as you're developing your 2026 Super Bowl ads, which we can't wait to see, how do you make sure the Super Bowl doesn't feel like a disconnected moment, but part of something bigger than.

Mark Kirkham [00:20:05]: Yeah, and I think what's critical is you start with what is your overall business objective for the brand? So, as you know, we're going to do a Pepsi Zero halftime show ad. And if you think about Pepsi Zero Sugar, Pepsi Zero Sugar has two main things we want to communicate. One is our great taste.

Mark Kirkham [00:20:20]: And two is continuing to drive the momentum and the broad awareness of the brand. People know Pepsi, but Pepsi Zero Sugar as a subset is much smaller than our core. And so for us to really reinforce taste and broader awareness, we need to do something that sparks either reappraisal or that sparks curiosity. Yes, it will entertain. And I think that is how we kind of frame out the creative strategy.

Mark Kirkham [00:20:41]: Because ultimately, a Pepsi ad will be remembered as a Pepsi ad. But if a Pepsi Zero Sugar ad is. Is remembered for challenging convention, for reinforcing or maybe questioning someone's taste preference, those are the types of things I think ultimately are tied to the broader business strategy. As you saw this past year, in 2025, we. We reran the Pepsi taste challenge.

Mark Kirkham [00:21:01]: We reran the Pepsi Taste Challenge. We hit over, you know, 25 cities. We did over several hundred thousand samples with consumers. We gave out over a million products, and we won everywhere we went versus our competition and the taste superiority. 66% of all those who tried it picked Pepsi Zero sugar over the competition.

Mark Kirkham [00:21:18]: How do I tell that story? What's a fun, creative way to celebrate that? And so that's the anchor point for, hey, should we do Super Bowl? How do we get this taste message out in a bold, creative, fun, little bit cheeky way that will actually show interest? And then next time someone's at the store, because there'll be plenty of displays, as Greg said out there, they'll try it and they'll try it again.

Mark Kirkham [00:21:37]: And because it tastes so good, they'll buy more. And so that kind of foundation is what you need to think about. You know, from brief all the way to execution. But let's be honest, it's Super Bowl, so it can't just be another taste ad, another product centric ad. It has to connect with culture.

Mark Kirkham [00:21:52]: It has to, you know, essentially excite people to want to get up off the couch and go buy something or challenge their preconceived notions. And so that is the core of what we're trying to do this year. And again last year it was about, it was about understanding taste and awareness. We relaunched Pepsi Zero on taste several years ago. We've got Poppy running its third ad ever again trying to drive broader awareness and celebrate the culture of the brand.

Mark Kirkham [00:22:14]: So there are just so many different reasons why you, you start the Super Bowl thinking process, but ultimately it will anchor back into kind of continuing on a trajectory of driving specific business and brand KPIs.

Greg Guidotti [00:22:25]: Yeah. And I think just to build on what Kirk was saying there, we've hammered the point about business objectives and brand objectives. It also has to connect with the positioning of the product. You know, what's that product's point of differentiation?

Greg Guidotti [00:22:36]: How does, what's its tone, what's its manner? Because, like, not all brands fit there. And now it's interesting. Nerds has fit there. And I think there could be opportunities for other brands and over, over the horizon.

Greg Guidotti [00:22:46]: But you know, for us, we're in a, you know, much smaller, smaller scale than, than my friend, my friend Kirkham. But I think this element of, you know, making, it's gotta be right in a lot of ways. And I think the only stakes is like, you gotta make sure that you, as you're staying true to your brand and you find this way to break through culturally feels like the way in, in a lot of ways. And whether that includes a talent or doesn't include a talent, it all, again, it depends on business, you know, brand objectives and the positioning of that product in and of itself. And I think we're lucky with Nerds to have a, you know, not only those Nerds characters that everybody knows from, from its launch in 1983, but the, you know, the gummy character reestablished the Nerds, gummy clusters.

Greg Guidotti [00:23:27]: So having a personality breaking through, breaking into culture on that kind of front.

Nataly Kelly [00:23:32]: Yeah, that's a great point, Greg. I happen to notice you have in the background quite a few different brands represented here. And so do you, Mark. So I'm, I'm, I'm trying to count how many brands do we each have represented here, but it's quite a lot.

Greg Guidotti [00:23:45]: I, I mean, Kirkham represents all kinds of Incredible blue chip businesses. I mean we humbly have around over over 20 brands us in which is great. And we mean it's like they're great, great businesses. You know, anything from, you know, my favorite growing up, Atomic Fireball to Lemon Head to Laffy Taffy to Jelly Belly to Trolli and if I want it all. Kirkham.

Mark Kirkham [00:24:02]: There you go. This is the Kirkham Guidotti special. I'm not kidding. That's real. This is real.

Mark Kirkham [00:24:08]: And this is something that we did. We connected together maybe a year ago and then we got our teams doing this and they did an excellent, excellent job and I would say I think it was a success for Pepsi for us. It, it not only drove a lot of trial for the, for the Trolli brand, refreshing the Trolli brand but it, you know, our base business is growing volume in like 9.6% and then in value maybe 11%. And so like the news, the news on something that's really relevant, really connected Trolli and Mountain Dew from a positioning perspective. Really.

Greg Guidotti [00:24:35]: I just saw this down on my desk, Kirkham, but it was like honestly we had a discussion as friends and colleagues a year ago and this came to market just this past, I don't know, September.

Mark Kirkham [00:24:44]: September, yeah. As an example.

Nataly Kelly [00:24:45]: Yeah, I love that example. In fact, I saw you guys talking about it on social media and that's how I knew you were connected, which is so cool.

Nataly Kelly [00:24:51]: And that was a limited edition that was only available for just a short amount of time. Right?

Mark Kirkham [00:24:56]: Yeah. Stay tuned. Good ideas can, can continue to grow and I think that's what makes it fun.

Greg Guidotti [00:25:02]: Yeah, I think that's exactly what makes it fun. When you find those, when you find those kind of points of connection, I mean it very much, you know, and you know, Trolli very much being a brand about, you know, pushing the boundaries and this kind of element, it really played into that, you know, all that Mountain Dew is doing, which is maybe my favorite brand. It is, Yeah. I got a picture of him from the 80s drinking Dew. So.

Mark Kirkham [00:25:19]: No, it's like, it's like I've been a Mountain Dew guy like my whole, my whole, whole, whole life.

Nataly Kelly [00:25:25]: Well, I love that collaboration because those two brands do seem to go very well together. That's, that's awesome. So Greg, I have another question for you. When you think about the Super Bowl, it's not just about the TV spot, as we've discussed, the best campaigns really do extend across social, across retail, across experience, experiential, all the different touch points where consumers actually engage with brands. So as you look at what Ferrara is building for this year. How do you think about the Super Bowl as a system, not just a single ad? What makes the difference between a great spot and a campaign that actually sticks with consumers after the game ends?

Greg Guidotti [00:25:56]: Yeah, I think it's, it's, it's interesting because it's almost again, like we spend a lot of time, like, how are we as an emotional brand, connecting with culture?

Greg Guidotti [00:26:03]: And I think, you know, whether you saw it, I mean, I think two years ago was maybe that time where Nerds really broke through with culture. And you know, we had, we had a couple pretty prime articles, but more importantly, we had consumers dressing up themselves and their animals like Nerds Gummy Clusters, which is just so that kind of, like when you have that kind of cultural connection, you know, you have something. So as we, as we approach this year, this element of, you know, getting into the football season and having some. We, we did a program with, with overtime and we did, you did some work with, with, you know, Cooper De Jean and he did some taste.

Greg Guidotti [00:26:37]: Taste elements. Like not only hardcore, but, you know, we launched a couple, you know, limited, limited time offers which are kind of football theme, you know, a Berry Punch Rush or a Cherry Lemonade Blitz. So like, we have, you know, adjacent products which are very close to the core to drive trial. And then you're, and then on the social front, you're connecting with football players. We've, we've done something with some Dallas cheerleader, Dallas Cowboy cheerleaders as well, which is painful for me because I'm a New York Football Giants fan and Kirkham's a, you know, we'll call him the Commanders now.

Greg Guidotti [00:27:09]: But, you know, I think he's, he's pretty worried because, you know, with us getting Arbach as the Giants coach, I mean, the Commanders are going to go down to the, the bottom of the NFC East. But I digress. But I think his element, this is just like that connecting with culture and catching and like, we talk like this like we're friends, we've known each other, we talk sports. That's some of the vernacular which actually consumers connect on. And that's what we're leveraging with Nerds, whether it be with players, cheerleaders.

Greg Guidotti [00:27:37]: So as it approaches to the, to, you know, to the fans and the games and like, that's how it really, you know, plays up to the spot itself.

Mark Kirkham [00:27:46]: Well, I mean, if it helps, I sponsor every team in the NFC, so I went either way.

Mark Kirkham [00:27:50]: Right. So the fact of the matter, if we're going to go, if we're going to go toe to toe. My, my friend is doing amazing work across the board.

Greg Guidotti [00:27:57]: And it's, and it's like, and honestly, I mean, I say it with my heart because we had that opportunity to work together, but the guy is, the guy is, you know, he's got, like, he's got the brands in his heart and that's how we grew up and, and to, to, to just live that. It makes every conversation we have on anything great, great. But the level at which she's operating is amazing. I love this. This is a love fest for the brands, for the products, for people.

Nataly Kelly [00:28:17]: That's awesome. And I will say Dallas Cowboy cheerleaders, like, I don't think you can go wrong there because they're beloved nationally.

Greg Guidotti [00:28:26]: So it's not the football players again. It's finding that it's, yeah, it's finding, it's finding that connection. It's something very special about that.

Greg Guidotti [00:28:30]: I, I didn't mean to discredit because I think it's great and I think everybody is very well recognized and candidly, we, we always, whoever we connect with, they are previously brands of, you know, fans of the brand. And I think it's very easy to find fans of our brand. And that's the thing. You don't, you don't force yourself into it.

Nataly Kelly [00:28:46]: That's so true. Yeah. I love seeing those costumes and everything. It's so fun. Okay, so we are going to move into our lightning round next and I would love to ask you a few quick hitting consumer insights related questions. Are you both ready?

Mark Kirkham [00:28:58]: Let's do it.

Greg Guidotti [00:28:58]: Okay, let's do it.

Nataly Kelly [00:28:59]: So this question is for you both. What's one thing brands overthink about Super Bowl advertising that should actually be simpler?

Greg Guidotti [00:29:07]: Sizzle versus steak. If you go for the sizzle, they focus on the steak. Keep it simple. Like if you try to chase the dream, you get nowhere. I'm going to build off simplicity.

Mark Kirkham [00:29:19]: I have a mantra I believe in which is make simple special. And the reality is, the simpler your idea, the more special you can make it. I think the biggest thing people get in, they get, they get worried about, they get stressed about, they overthink is how do I make my Super Bowl ad be the most amazing Super Bowl ad versus how do I make my idea, my simple idea really special at that amazing moment in time? So keep it simple is probably the number one goal, I would say. And I think the other thing is I could care less what other businesses or brands are doing.

Mark Kirkham [00:29:47]: I care about what our brand is doing and how we're going to connect with the consumer. I think that's. And I think that, you know, keep making simple Special is a great moniker. You know, Maya, is this element of, like, when you start chasing the sizzle, you get malware. Just go for the steak.

Nataly Kelly [00:30:05]: Yeah. I mean, I think it's great advice, and I think, you know, it's a good reminder that simple doesn't have to mean mundane. You know, it can be special, and it can. I think simple is not creatively boring or not interesting. If your idea is simple, you can add amazing creativity.

Mark Kirkham [00:30:20]: Yeah. And it's hard to make complex ideas simple. So I think that's. That's awesome when we see that in action.

Nataly Kelly [00:30:25]: Okay, my next question. What's the biggest myth about Super Bowl advertising that you wish would go away?

Mark Kirkham [00:30:35]: That you need celebrities to make a great Super Bowl ad? And by the way, I'm guilty of it. But I think if you really break it down the. In today's world, the simplicity of a great idea can outweigh the celebrity of a great actor, musician, athlete.

Mark Kirkham [00:30:47]: And now I do think there's benefits to it. Don't get me wrong. I've done it myself. But I'll tell you, in our ad this year, the only celebrity is the director, and he won an Oscar. Even it at that.

Mark Kirkham [00:30:58]: Because, you know, there might be some perceived celebrity, there might be some, you know, celebrity storytelling aspect of what we're doing, but do I need to add a celebrity to this idea? No. In some cases, if that celebrity can authentically amplify your core idea, then hell yes, you should. You should leverage them. But I think that's the biggest myth.

Mark Kirkham [00:31:12]: Like, you don't need a celebrity to make a great Super Bowl ad.

Greg Guidotti [00:31:15]: No, it's, again, like, I think it's important that you connect with culture. It's important that your brand breaks through. Celebrity can work. Celebrity might not work.

Greg Guidotti [00:31:24]: I think the biggest. The biggest myth is, you know, like, breakthrough. Break. Breakthrough. Breakthrough.

Greg Guidotti [00:31:32]: Like, let's break through. If we break through. Well, if breakthrough doesn't get to conversion. How many times have you said, I saw that ad. Who was it for?

Greg Guidotti [00:31:42]: There's no. There's no misattribution to any Nerd's ad. And I think I might. I might be driving more. We as a team might be driving more fundamentals in terms of consumption moment in terms of branding and these kind of things in here.

Greg Guidotti [00:31:57]: But we're. We have a. We have a sole purpose, a brand objective and a business objective in terms of these elements. So you need it to come across and for your brand to get credit. So I think people get distracted by breakthrough.

Greg Guidotti [00:32:08]: You know what, let's have Mark Kirkham be the guy in this ad.

Nataly Kelly [00:32:14]: Well, I think the data actually proves you both correct because the data, you know, from Zappy when we look at this, shows on average that the brands that include or the ads that include celebrities don't necessarily perform any better. It really depends on the articulation, what they are trying to achieve. But the other thing is the brand recall is not as high for a lot of those celeb based ads. It really depends on the, you know, many other aspects. Not just do I have a celebrity or not.

Mark Kirkham [00:32:36]: The celebrity needs to be in service of the brand in the message. That's really it. And if it's, if it's about the celebrity not in service of the brand or the message, like what are you doing, guys?

Nataly Kelly [00:32:44]: Well, a lot of times they will, you know, the, the consumer will say, oh, I remember that ad with Celebrity X. But they don't remember which brand it was.

Mark Kirkham [00:32:52]: And then it's worse when you have the same celebrity and multiple ads then they really get confused. So yeah, well that's great.

Nataly Kelly [00:32:59]: So another question that I had for both of you is what's your all time favorite Super Bowl ad and why does it stick with you?

Mark Kirkham [00:33:07]: I think there's no one. And, and I'm not going to just pick our ads because like I'm a, I'm a student of the craft and so I love to see great work from lots of different people.

Mark Kirkham [00:33:15]: I do. That being said, PepsiCo as a company has put some of the best, you know, Super Bowl ads out there over the last 20, 30 years. Um, ones that I think resonate with me and they happen to be PepsiCo brands are all the crash to Super Bowl spots.

Greg Guidotti [00:33:33]: Which one was that? Her crush.

Mark Kirkham [00:33:35]: The Super Bowl. All the Doritos crash. The Super Bowl spots. I mean the, the, you know, when that, when that idea, you know, came up, you know, well over a decade ago, it was new, it was unique, it was a different approach to creating ads and the, the actual work is phenomenal. You know, young directors who came up and made amazing stories and did some pretty provocative creative is, is fantastic.

Mark Kirkham [00:33:58]: I mean I think Pepsi in our past did a great job of using celebrity and Super Bowl to celebrate the brand, whether it's Britney or what have you. But actually if I look more recently, I really like what Uber Eats is doing. I really like what Instacart's doing. I really like What Doordash did and why, because they celebrated their core business, you know, which is delivering stuff. They brought the NFL in in an authentic way around the big game as either a moment or part of their story.

Mark Kirkham [00:34:25]: Like Uber Eats, they brought many of our brands along, so there's an added benefit. So, you know, Puppy Monkey Baby was in one. You know, we. Mountain Dew was in doordashes. So, you know, I. I think there's just.

Mark Kirkham [00:34:36]: There's. It's changing because we're using our brands to tell stories about consumer behavior. And ultimately, as the world has evolved in kind of the different channels and the different brands that are relevant to those channels, the storytelling becomes more complicated. Right. And so for Doordash or Instacart last year, to tell stories about their business and what they do by using brands or brand mascots to tell their story, it's just brilliant.

Mark Kirkham [00:34:58]: So I will give Ko Fi and the DoorDash team and the Instacart teams tons of credit for. For all the work that they've done to make a service creatively interesting and partnering with brands to do it. So. And then I guess it would go without saying if you said as a kid growing up, the Clydesdales will always be a favorite. So, you know, the ABI team, I gotta give them credit, like, just sticking with something so simple, so special and so consistent.

Mark Kirkham [00:35:23]: That's magic and something to be expected. And you look forward to it. And that element, in terms of like, in terms of that the Clydesdales are. Are a classic and you look forward to, you know, how. How great that can be.

Greg Guidotti [00:35:35]: I think it was interesting. I was talking to a friend of mine and. And he was thinking, saying about the frogs Budweiser. And I honestly went to. Was up and I.

Greg Guidotti [00:35:45]: And I liked was up. I'm just shitting the bud because it got to the, like how guys connected over a Budweiser, regardless of where they are, what they do. So that was one that I always thought was a. An interesting one. But Puppy Monkey Baby is a close one too.

Greg Guidotti [00:36:00]: It's. It's a crazy. It's a crazy cuckoo when it was like, it was again. But as I think about, like, I really like what Kirk was saying because, like, as, you know, a student of the craft or you've been in this your whole, like, you're really trying to pick apart. What do you think their objective was?

Greg Guidotti [00:36:14]: What are they doing there? Uber did a great job, but I think was up for me, it's just that element that just real. It broke through there. Was just something cool about it, which is very relevant, too. So I guess Budweiser gets some good points in this one.

Mark Kirkham [00:36:30]: They do. They get some points. But if I knew you're going to bring up Puppy Monkey Baby, I would have grabbed Puppy Monkey Baby out of the closet. Because the actual doll is around the corner here. And we loaned it.

Mark Kirkham [00:36:43]: And we loaned it to Instacart for that. So, like, it was missing for weeks. So, like, I don't know what happened. I think that it was an Instacart speaks to the fact that it was classic.

Greg Guidotti [00:36:52]: Yeah, I think that element had some staying power because it was just so, you know, crazy in a good way.

Nataly Kelly [00:36:58]: I love the collaboration between brands, and the Instacart is definitely memorable. That ad from last year because of all the different brand mascots and teaming up. But it also just. It's like, that's what people see when they open their pantry or open their fridge or in their household. Like, it's highly relatable, and it makes the consumer feel like, oh, I'm seen, I'm reflected, I'm mirrored.

Nataly Kelly [00:37:15]: And there's a lot of great things there. So I hope we see more fun collaborations from both of you on the product side with the Trolli Mountain Dew collabs and others with the advertisers that you partner with and team up with. That's really, really fun. So, okay, if you could give only one piece of advice to a CMO doing their first. First Super Bowl, what would it be?

Greg Guidotti [00:37:34]: I mean, I think the element is like, there's this element of, like, we brought it up. Like, this is, you know, marketing into totality is an art and a science. And I think. But by the fact when you get to this Super Bowl stage, like, you're probably got some experience here. You know, kind of what your brand is about.

Greg Guidotti [00:37:47]: Like, trust your gut, Trust your team straight through to your brand. And I think, you know, and if I were to just plagiarize off Kirk of this element of simple being magic, I think that, like, it's having that in your head. You don't need to, like, this, this. And then we have a, you know, this crazy bomb, and then this car jumps here. It's like.

Greg Guidotti [00:38:05]: It's this element of, like. I think it's very much about, you know, trust your gut, trust your team. Stay true to your brand. This is probably the biggest audience you'll ever one time put a message in front of. So don't worry about the audience.

Mark Kirkham [00:38:19]: Worry about your message. Because I think too often people get stressed because it is 127 million people at one time. The reality is each one of those is a single person looking and watching that screen, looking to be entertained, to be informed. And if you get across your idea, you get across your message, and you're confident about it, both creatively and strategically, you win. Whether or not you get number one on the ad meter or you end up number 10.

Mark Kirkham [00:38:44]: If there's enough people out there who understood your brand message, who were entertained or intrigued by the story you told in 30 seconds, you win. And being too worried about the expense or the exposure or what people will say after. What I worry about is, will it drive sales?

Greg Guidotti [00:39:00]: Yeah. Will it be.

Mark Kirkham [00:39:01]: That's the point. Because I think I don't is the most important thing. And I think that's the biggest advice I give you. It's like, focus on the message, focus on the brand benefit or whatever story you're telling. Don't worry about the stage.

Mark Kirkham [00:39:13]: It's like you tell any musician before a big opening gig. Just go out there and do your thing. And I think that if you know your craft, you know your story, then you'll be successful. If you know what your goals are, what do you want to do? Because I go harken back to our first Nerds Super Bowl ad, which I think was amazing.

Greg Guidotti [00:39:26]: And I. I think it. I think it broke through, but most importantly, it grew our household penetration by six points. Six points, which is, you know, and I don't know where we ended up on the ad meter. I remember the six points. That's great.

Nataly Kelly [00:39:41]: That's great. A good reminder of keeping the most important goal in mind and not overly fixating on rankings. That's wonderful. Well, I want to thank both of you. This wraps up this episode of Inside Insights.

Nataly Kelly [00:39:54]: A huge thank you to Mark Kirkham, CMO of PepsiCo Beverages, US and Greg Guidotti, CMO for Ferrara Candy Company, for joining us and sharing how the world's biggest brands think about the world's biggest stage. If you'd like to connect with Mark or Greg, you'll find links to their LinkedIn profiles in the show notes or at insideinsightspod.com. If you haven't subscribed yet and you want a regular stream of research and insights knowledge in your podcast feed, hit that subscribe button in your podcast app or follow us on YouTube. Okay, that's all for today. Until next time.

Greg Guidotti [00:40:23]: Thank you.